I have a 73 rd350 project . Prior posts indicate that some earlier clutch assemblies are different,... Just want to figure out exactly what I have here.
Case numbers are 351-112436 . I think that means that I need 7 plates and 7 fibers ?
Also, I have 2 different types of plates and was wondering what the differences are.
If you have a 73 you most likely have a 6 plate clutch unless someone already upgraded it to a 7 plate. The plate on the left in your pic is an RD400 steel.
Thanks J Spooner. The bike was a mess when I got it and many things had been changed (Not upgrades though) Is there any way to measure anything there just to be sure?
Metal plates always go in first, Right? Thanks Again
Yes, post pics of the inner hub. If its a 6 plate clutch it will use a spider inner hub.
7 plate clutches use 6 metal plates and 7 fiber plates.
6 plate clutch has 6 metal plates and 6 fiber plates with one steel plate being thicker and is used as the first plate to go in as its the back plate.
Stock mid year '74 and later use a aluminum back plate and don't use a thick steel plate.
Chuck
Thanks Chuck, I will post pics later today.
This one had 6 metal and 7 fiber plates in it when I took it apart,....I didn't think that was correct,...I though you always start with a metal plate. :umm: ?
That style of hub and pressure plate should only have 6 of each plate.
OK, Got it. All my steels are the same thickness,...Any idea where I can find the thicker plate (that goes in first) that Chuck referred to in a previous post?
All the ones I am seeing for sale look like the same and make no mention of thickness. Thanks
Quote from: suey1958 on November 30, 2019, 09:54:42 PM
OK, Got it. All my steels are the same thickness,...Any idea where I can find the thicker plate (that goes in first) that Chuck referred to in a previous post?
All the ones I am seeing for sale look like the same and make no mention of thickness. Thanks
I have some.
So it should have one thick steel 5 thinner steels, and 6 fibers.
Thanks JSpooner for the clarification on that. I will be sending you a PM,... First going to try and determine if I am missing any other parts before I message you.
From here it looks like hes got an early cover with a later inner hub. Either way if Joe has the parts upgrade to the later 7 plate clutch, Yamaha changed the design to eliminate slippage issues. You just use the later inner hub, later cover (it will have "teeth" that engage the inner hub), and 6 thin steel plates.
Does this look like the cover that I should be using? The previous owner had some things all mixed up,...Truth is that I dont know much more than he did. LOL
I really appreciate all this info, as the decaf project I'm working on came with seven steels and washers on the screws. Didn't the washers get added in '72? Thought they caused the scraping in the case, but now I think it was the extra plate, since the cover wasn't centered over the six screws when I pulled the cover. Do the '71 R5Bs get washers on pressure plate screws, or not? The manual's I have say no, according to the pics.
Quote from: suey1958 on December 01, 2019, 11:45:41 AM
Does this look like the cover that I should be using? The previous owner had some things all mixed up,...Truth is that I dont know much more than he did. LOL
Yes, that is the right top pressure plate. Use that with the inner hub you have installed.
The inner hub is right for a 7 fiber plates and 6 normal steels. This is known as the 7 plate '74 mid later and all 75 RD350's.
A thick plate is only used on the inner spider hub with 5 normal plates and 6 fibers and 1 thick is the first one in as a back plate.
These are all known as early '74, 73 RD's, R5's and DS7's 6 plate clutch.
We call them by 6 or 7 is how many fibers each clutch have.
Is this another case of wrong info in the manual? I am not trying to contradict anyone, you guys obviously know what you're doing. Why do they show a steel next to the pressure plate for 1972 r5c? That makes sevens steels and six fibers.
Quote from: Greaser Greg on December 01, 2019, 09:23:52 PM
Is this another case of wrong info in the manual? I am not trying to contradict anyone, you guys obviously know what you're doing. Why do they show a steel next to the pressure plate for 1972 r5c? That makes sevens steels and six fibers.
I just dug out an old 6 plate clutch. Low and behold there are 7 steels all together. One of them is the extra thick one on the bottom and the last one on top is against the pressure plate like you say. So looks like the manual is right.
Yes... I'm corrected, I forgot about the last plate being a steel for the pressure plate to push on.
I do know if you change from the spider early hub you need to change the #16 in the diagram to a late thrust washer against the input shaft bearing. The early 6 plate is a stepped thrust washer and is thinner.
Both have to be the same thicker one in a 7 plate later model clutch. Any RD400's thrust washers will work.
That was one I had to help a customer earlier this year figure out what was wrong with his conversion from the 6 to the 7 plate clutch.
Chuck
Thanks Guys, Just to be sure I am clear on this,... (Rd350) Using the later model hub and pressure plate.
We have 7 fiber plates,... we start the install with a fiber plate. Correct?
We have a total of 7 steel plates (all the same size) That way we end up with a steel plate for the pressure plate to push on. Correct?
Also will go back and check to see if I have the correct ( thinner) thrust washer. Thanks Again!
Late 7 plate clutch is 7 fibers and only 6 normal steels.
Start with fiber, end in fiber. 6 steels in between.
Must use thicker thrust washer as the first one on the shaft next to the input bearing.
Both thrust washer will be the same in a late 7 plate setup.
Only the early 6 plate will use the stepped (thinner) thrust washer in your pic as #16.
So, in a late 7 plate clutch both thrust washers are the same.
In a early 6 plate clutch the thrust washers are different. The stepped (thinner) one goes on the shaft first.
Got it yet?
Chuck
Got it now Chuck, Thanks for the help :clap:
Got my new clutch cable in today, got clutch plates in as advised, bolts tightened and torqued today. Everything was looking very good until I determined that the side case cover was bottoming out on the pressure plate screws. (took screws out and the cover slid right on with pressure plate still on)
I am guessing that my thrust washer(s) are too thick,...OR I forgot to mention that these engine cases have the 3 screw retainer that some do not have and wondering if that makes a difference. That was the reason I couldn't use 2 identical washers that Chuck suggested, Got a bunch of parts to work from, just dont know if I have the right ones,... Hope the pics help.
Are the spring bolts tight in the pics?
If they are, it's not right. I'll see what I have at the shop to look at again.
They shouldn't stick that far out from the pressure plate...
Chuck
Yes Sir, They are tight and in as far as they will go,...I have some other clutch screws but they are all the same size (35MM long)
that stepped washer is for NON 3 screw retainer motor. (r5 etc)
no way that clutch is set up right, the screw heads should be almost flush with the pressure plate. :twocents:
Hey Mark, thats not a stepped washer, Its flat, (but it does look like it in the pic) Its just shiny on the outside edge. I remembered you saying not to use the stepped washer when I was at your shop. (You was going to turn it down on your lathe but I told you I had a flat one at home.)
I wanted to illustrate why I didnt use identical washers as chuck suggested,...The washer with the smaller O.D. was used inside the retainer,....Larger one was too big. Thanks
I'll be at the shop in about an hour...PM sent.
C
gotcha.
Clearance problem solved,...Took the p plate off and ran the bolts in to be sure they were going in all the way as they should. To my surprise they were NOT. They were so tight I thought they may break off or strip threads. Took a chanceand Ran the old bolts in all the way with vice grips. I had a fresh set of bolts that went in fine after that. So far, so good. Thanks for the help
I posted up some more info here on clutch assemblies...
Chuck
http://www.2strokeworld.net/forum/index.php?topic=1304.0 (http://www.2strokeworld.net/forum/index.php?topic=1304.0)