Aftermarket Ignitions

[m in sc]

Post below to identify and discuss the nuances of aftermarket ignition components. 

[m in sc]

installation instructions from hawaii-mike. thanks mike!

http://www.2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/general-tech/ignitions/Martek-ignition-instructions.pdf

[Vintagewannabe]

What are the benefits of using and ignition system that replaces all the components, such as the vape, as opposed to one like the dyna s or hpi that replace only your points?
I don't have any charging problems, just looking into what all I need to do to make my 350 safe to rev past redline.

[m in sc]

hpi changes the charging system as well.  a vape can have a programmable module added (zeeltronic) . the drum is heavy though, but still better than the stock unit.  the zeeltronic box lets you program in a rev limiter and a dynamic curve. ie: retards timing up high int he rpm range. remember, 2 strokes basically have climbing compression the faster they spin because the time the port window is open on the exhaust is reduced the faster the motor spins. . 

the stock charging ones have wound rotors for charging, they are heavy and at best 50 years old at this point. sustained high rpm will kill them sooner than later.

[Vintagewannabe]

hpi changes the charging system as well.  a vape can have a programmable module added (zeeltronic) . the drum is heavy though, but still better than the stock unit.  the zeeltronic box lets you program in a rev limiter and a dynamic curve. ie: retards timing up high int he rpm range. remember, 2 strokes basically have climbing compression the faster they spin because the time the port window is open on the exhaust is reduced the faster the motor spins. . 

the stock charging ones have wound rotors for charging, they are heavy and at best 50 years old at this point. sustained high rpm will kill them sooner than later.

I did see one post mention that you can't qdjust timing if you use the woodruff key mod that HVC offers. Is that true, or does it just force you to use the zeeltronic box?

[m in sc]

the keyed rotor sets it at 2.0mm or 1.8.. meaning oyu cant advance it whish sort of defeats the purpose of a zeel.  you dont need a keyway.

trust me on this one. 

[Vintagewannabe]

the keyed rotor sets it at 2.0mm or 1.8.. meaning oyu cant advance it whish sort of defeats the purpose of a zeel.  you dont need a keyway.

trust me on this one. 

that's kind of what I have been leaning toward based on what I have seen. I also saw that they claim a margin of error of .2. So you could end up advanced to 2.2, and most people seem to say you should set at 1.8 for modern gas.

[m in sc]

its fine tbh. the keyway will not keep it from rotating regardless of what people say. take it from me, ive been a mechanical engineer for 25+ years and messing with these way longer than that. ;) the keyway is strictly for locating. the taper holds it. Id really recommend an HPI ignition though. has a nice built in curve.

[Vintagewannabe]

its fine tbh. the keyway will not keep it from rotating regardless of what people say. take it from me, ive been a mechanical engineer for 25+ years and messing with these way longer than that. ;) the keyway is strictly for locating. the taper holds it. Id really recommend an HPI ignition though. has a nice built in curve.

with them there seems to be an internal, or a mini rotor version. Whats the difference?
It also mentions using a voltage regulator from trailtech, but even after buying this, the system is still hundreds of dollars cheaper than a vape.

[m in sc]

internal rotor version has no charging system. its ign only  (race)

I run 4 vapes on my bikes currently, and 2 hpi cdis. nothing wrong w the HPI systems except they have a relatively fixed curve , so a programmer isnt really an option ( they do have an optional box), BUT, the Vape TBH is just a lot heartier, its bigger and right out of the box its ready to run with 200W charging. the HPI has a singe wire 60w system.  you can modify it to be a 2 wire and then run a single phase reg/rectifier OR run full ac lighting.  you have to get kinda int he weeds wiring either, but the hpi is def more finicky.

direct from vape its 515.00.

the hpi is 265 plus add 50 ish for a regulator. OR a regulator and get creative w the wiring. its stil going to be a lot less charging power which is probably ok with all the modern led stuff out now.

I can say this, they are both really good units. for longevity id go vape, they are just built better/stronger. But if cost is your main driver then the hpi might be the best option. they do wind up very fast and i havent had a failure yet. (and that about a decade of time)

 

[Vintagewannabe]

internal rotor version has no charging system. its ign only  (race)

I run 4 vapes on my bikes currently, and 2 hpi cdis. nothing wrong w the HPI systems except they have a relatively fixed curve , so a programmer isnt really an option ( they do have an optional box), BUT, the Vape TBH is just a lot heartier, its bigger and right out of the box its ready to run with 200W charging. the HPI has a singe wire 60w system.  you can modify it to be a 2 wire and then run a single phase reg/rectifier OR run full ac lighting.  you have to get kinda int he weeds wiring either, but the hpi is def more finicky.

direct from vape its 515.00.

the hpi is 265 plus add 50 ish for a regulator. OR a regulator and get creative w the wiring. its stil going to be a lot less charging power which is probably ok with all the modern led stuff out now.

I can say this, they are both really good units. for longevity id go vape, they are just built better/stronger. But if cost is your main driver then the hpi might be the best option. they do wind up very fast and i havent had a failure yet. (and that about a decade of time)

 

I appreciate all of the firsthand experience. Other reading I have done seems to agree with the vape being more solid and refined.
Also seems to be a good idea to use the heavy bolt and washer kit from economy. Seems to eliminate the slip problem, and not have to cut a keyway.

[m in sc]

the keyway doesn't keep it from slipping