so next year will be 20 years since i first cobbled this (1st iteration) project together and figured it needed some updates. nothing major, but detail stuff. Also some major items but that's in the works in parallel, so to speak.
this will include a lot of little things, but 1st i wanted to update the hydraulic clutch setup. I 1st did it in 07? ish, then landed on a ducati master & slave cyl, but never really liked the cosmetics. also, i wasn't sure what the slave came off of so i bought an aftermarket one for a multistrada and made up a cleaner adapter (this is all bolt on not cover mods). running a rebuilt brembo clutch master.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-motor-23-PREP_04.jpg)
this is the 2 mount holes, i added 2 more to utilize the 4 M5 bolt holes in the cover.
at work at lunch one day.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-motor-23-PREP_06.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-motor-23-PREP_08.jpg)
test fit. its double drilled so i can rotate the slave 180 if i want to later.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-motor-23-PREP_07.jpg)
turned some hex stainless, and tapped it to make it adjustable the stuff in it is an old head stud from an rd motor cut, dressed, then hardened at the end. the brass nut is an 11mm hex/8mm thread vw exhaust nut.
the female side it drilled to accept a stock pushrod, even stepped to take the shouldered part. but shallow enough so only the end contacts internally. its drilled about 1.5" in.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-parts1-clutch_09-1.jpg)
the black line is a visual marker for setup i can look thru the old clutch cable boss hole to see the amount of movement. the hex on the shaft was turned down just a tad so it had rounded edges and slides in the adapter smooth with maybe .010" of clearance.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-parts1-clutch_08.jpg)
I have a stock clutch adj cover i nee do mod to fill int he gaps here but you get the point. can also see the other 2 M5 countersunk screws for mounting here.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-parts1-clutch_11.jpg)
fully assembled, ive ridden it its really good.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-motor-23-PREP_12.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-motor-23-PREP_11.jpg)
Does it NEED a hydraulic clutch? no. i do like the feel though. this unit is a bit larger diameter than the older one bore wise, so it has more feel to it at the grab point. was cheap too, i paid less than 60 bucks for it. nice thing is it has a c-clip to keep the piston on so it cant fall out. the stock ducati one would just fall out if it was out and somebody hit the lever. Boo.
I have more planned for the lower end of this bike. I also did a new clutch basket.. so it will make the hyd clutch a bit more useful as its getting a nice beefy clutch and a few other.. things to support future improvements.. (which may also include some top end improvements..? ) in the next couple of months. :whistle: But as of now, just getting the 'basement' in order. aside from the hyd clutch, right now all the other work is being done off bike, its still running riding great.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-parts1-clutch_01.jpg)
new basket and cush rubbers.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-parts1-clutch_02-1.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-parts1-clutch_03.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-parts1-clutch_07.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-parts1-clutch_06.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-motor-23-PREP_09.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-motor-23-PREP_13.jpg)
spare cases were dropped off for some cleanup work to be done.
.... :whistle:
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-motor-23-PREP_03.jpg)
Wow! It looks great so far. I can't wait to see more of it!
Bold and mysterious undertakings; waiting with anticipation :huh:
Very cool.
hmmm, more engineering and performance shenanigans going on at the Haase workshop :science:
Looking forward to seeing what is behind door #1!
Its going to be a new bottom end with all new stuff TBH.
the NEW crank, IS a vitos crank. why? few reasons. 1: if it wasn't trued right, i can fixt that. I checked it on v blocks, theres one spot thats 0.0005", the rest was dead nuts. 2: It comes with Koyo 8-ball ball bearings, so , no reason not to use it. 3: also, they have the 'pork chop' flywheels. some history on that:
the last new crank i built for this bike i went all in , pro x rods, all top notch stuff. flywheels looked great, and did it myself. few yrs later, i thought i had a piston going . nope. took topend off and found this:
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-motor-23-PREP_02.jpg)
that shiny spot is the weight that came loose from the crank and was hitting the rod. it wiggles around pretty good in there too. so, at the time i had a rebuilt crank on hand of unknown origin, and i threw it in.
fast forward to the lightweight and i used a similar vitos style LC crank, and its been top notch. talking to a few people that ACTUALLY know what they are doing, they gave good reviews after seeing them in hard (race) use for a few years.
The replacment bottom end that been in it for the past..7? years has been good but i dont have a ton of confidence in it, and it was sort of hodge-podged together at the time. Its GOOD, but this bike IMHO should be better than 'ok' for me. Just a want.
The top end stuff is in the works, but may be next year before that might get installed. Just fresh LC top with some new porting by somebody wayyyyy more talented than i am. But for the meantime, its just going to get a fresh bottom end.
got the cases vapor blasted locally to support my local shop. and, he's good and fast. so fast, i didn't ride the bike w the big rack but told me it was done.. so, i borrowed 2 ratchet straps from a co-worker and.. went and got it. on the way the led headlight bulb died, so also had to change that out with an H4. Unusual, never had anauxito one die before. anyway... very please w results. got home, chased every damn thread, cleaned it all out and brake cleaned it, then put in the new main case studs.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-cases-done_7.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-cases-done_1.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-cases-done_6.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-cases-done_4.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-cases-done_3.jpg)
ooo, those are purdy! :clap:
Very nice.
It looks like if you cut off the clutch slave's third mounting ear and milled a spacer slug that fit into the adjuster cover hole you could almost use the stock mounting bolt holes. Would it be stiff enough with only 2 ears?
IR8D8R
the bolt circle 1: is slightly larger on the master 2: more importantly, it isn't parallel to cl axis and 3: no, not in my opinion.
I mean, that's an hours work on manual machines to make, wasn't hard at all IMHO. im sure there are other slave cyls out there that you could make work like that, or just make one from scratch, which i did consider, and use the guts from this one. I looks like its sticking WAY out there especially sinc eim running a flat timing cover, but TBH, its maybe 3mm longer than the old one.
Nice looking clutch rebuild. Had to do that a couple of times on an RD and a couple of TZs which are a little different.
BTW, do not be tempted to clear coat those nice vapor blasted cases. I did that once and they looked like they had been painted and I could have achieved that same look with a 10 buck rattle can. Don't be like me..
I know better. lol. but good advice. I considered getting them ceracoated black but prefer the bare aluminum. I've had lots of carbs vapor blasted, they all still look new
few assembly pics. this motor is super low miles, so the transmission had zero, and i mean -zero- signs of wear. there aren't even bright spots on the shift forks. so, decided to use it.
every piece of hardware is new, all case bolts and nuts are stainless aside from the main ones which are oem yamaha. Oddly, i couldn't find my new neutral switch, so put in a used one for the moment. changed -every- seal and bearing.
there isn't much remarkable about it mod wise, except a few tricks i did. the top case, where the transfers are, i radiused the sharp edges, and gasket matched the ducts. i chamfered the bearing oiling holes to help the mixture get in there easier, and on the bottom of the top case i also radiused the sharp edges above the crank to help flow a bit. will this matter in the long run? beats me but it sure cant hurt to make it all get into and out of the cases to transfer ports with smoother more laminar (as much as possible) flow.
the crank measured out as i said almost perfect (0.0005" at one spot on one bearing for about 20 degrees), its super smooth. also, i polished surfaces to a mirror finish that contacts a seal, shift shaft, primary drive gear, & (new) clutch push rod. the shifter detent star wheel was also polished smooth and the Neutral trough was shaped a bit deeper to get a more positive neutral. the shift fork shafts were also polished. Just a detailed rebuild for the most part.
radiused edges on top case:
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/LC-LOWER-END-REASSEMBLE_12.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/LC-LOWER-END-REASSEMBLE_15.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/LC-LOWER-END-REASSEMBLE_19.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/LC-LOWER-END-REASSEMBLE_20.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/LC-LOWER-END-REASSEMBLE_23.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-lower-assembled-23_4.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-lower-assembled-23_1.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-lower-assembled-23_2.jpg)
look at that crusty switch! will trim breather tube back a bit later.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-lower-assembled-23_7.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/lc-lower-assembled-23_5.jpg)
Beautiful work. What is that "extra" big slotted screw thing on the bottom just adjacent to the drain plug?
Quote from: kpke on November 13, 2023, 08:45:06 AMBeautiful work. What is that "extra" big slotted screw thing on the bottom just adjacent to the drain plug?
thanks. :gentleman: thats the shift plate detent spring holder. some are bolts, others, later ones i think, are slotted. this is a very late set of 73 cases and its what was in it. I think they changed it to slotted so it wouldn't be confused for a drain bolt (since they were both 17mm head bolts)
lunch project, made a delrin shaft sleeve . the sprocket is 10mm offset so it won't work well w the stock one. this a hair shorter so I can use an o ring on the shaft to keep it from falling off when the covers pulled off. also machined a blanking insert for the clutch cable boss (after work at home while angie was cooking dinner).
Nice :righteous: :righteous:
Work of Art! The Hydraulic Clutch is TOPS.
Unfortunately, the Japanese were still mastering their casting in the 70s and aluminum was much more porous in their cases then. As experienced as you are with converting to LCs, you probably have noticed the difference between the 80s castings and 70s castings. If you really want to keep the case clean and not end up with black pores, you'll probably want to get a can of CRC 3-36 or similar and keep them coated. I agree with a previous post about how terrible vapor honed aluminum looks with a clear coat. I spray everything I vapor hone with 3-36, unless I plan to anodize, powder or paint.
so, with all the other projects wrapped up, the KZ, the big bore kit on the XR, 72 R5 stuff (pipes) and other small things, back on the LC project. I've been gathering small parts here and there , this also included new silicone hoses, and rethinking the hose routing. this included the angled water neck fitting i made 2? weeks ago at work.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/water-neck-fitting/lc_head-fitting-90degree_1-rotated-e1707763662610.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/lower-end-2023/water-neck-fitting/lc_head-fitting-90degree_8.jpg)
and the hose routing. i wasnt a fan of running the line under the reed-cage, even though its been that way almost 20 yrs, this should def flow a bit easier:
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/2024-motor/lc-intake-coolant-lines-prelim_5-rotated.jpg)
this is all mocking up w the 'original' motor still in place. you can also see a lot of the wiring. you may notice there are individual fuse holders. i -have had- a few fuse boxes int his over the years, but the inline ones seem to work better long term, for me, and theres a junction terminal where they all come off of. (can take diff pics later showing that). its nowhere near as chaotic as it may seem.
then, i had to move onto the intake. I had a shorter yet thicker walled 3-d printed y boot done up and decided to go with a large uni (its probably a -bit- overkill) :dawg:
the billet intake worked really well but was so long, I had to make it shorter.this wasnt super easy, as i needed about 3/8" min room to make it fit better.
you can see here how long this was. this was with small body VM34s back in 13 or so:
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/vforce-billetintake/vforcereeds-intake-2013-5_zpsbc03a144.jpg)
I had to mill the front plate, to the reeds, down about 5mm, the main body in about 3mm, and the rest i swing the head on the bridgeport and took as much as i could off the rubber spigot mounts.
as it is now:
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/2024-motor/lc-intake-coolant-lines-prelim_1-rotated.jpg)
this is the newer beefier y-boot and uni,
back side of the intake, used the sandring drum on the die grinder to smooth out ans shape inside, matches the reedgages as well. Internal crossover still intact.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/2024-motor/lc-intake-coolant-lines-prelim_2-rotated.jpg)
closer look, some scarring and useage marks, def not a show bike.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/2024-motor/lc-intake-coolant-lines-prelim_4-rotated.jpg)
I also removed the fan, it almost never kicked on, like maybe 2 times ever? it just doesn't run hot. also, the 2 cables laying over the radiator are choke cables, the lever is on the other side, used a snowmobile setup.
and a gratuitous shot of the filter and y boot.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/2024-motor/lc-intake-coolant-lines-prelim_3-rotated.jpg)
:metal: :metal: :metal:
:stupid-1: love this :thumbs: :bacon:
:clap: Very nice! Some serious looking intake hardware there
Moto porn! :humpty: So nice! :swoon:
Might you make that Y-boot available to the masses someday?
steve burgess sells them. I just designed that one. reach out on FB to him.
as a side note, after I drew it up I printed a mini version to verify the geometry was ok, the initial model of this version had a tiny void that was near impossible to see, so this was a test part I did at work, then sent the file to steve.
Very impressive work. That intake system is beautiful.
What material is used for the 3d printing to make it gasoline proof?
thanks. :gentleman: I honestly dont remember, he told me once. I do know, def not in the motor side, but filter side is ok.
as an update: i measure the cyls, it hasn't been rebored in maybe 8-9 yrs. This was a set of cyls scott clough did for me back in.. 07? 08? the skirt clearances were where it needed to be rebored, they looked great but .. worn. so, while i could have had them rebored, i decided to go another way and have my second set i had done by John Ritter bored. I have a bit of intake and decking work to do, but this should be even juicier. especially with the new larger v-force reeds ive had set aside... :devil: I have a few other things i want to address anyway, so the time isnt an issue.
Very cool.
cyls at shop, new wossners on way. :olaf:
Excellent
Yea I had a similar thing happen to my RD crank as the lead weight fell out and rubbed up against the connecting rod. I felt the engine lock up momentarily. It surprised me thought I seized. I too installed a vitos crank and I am very happy with the results.
Great work Marc. You should be an RD fab specialist!
im not sure about that.. lol.. but i appreciate the compliment.
but speaking of fabrication.. the rearset mounts i cnc'd like... back in 08? or so? have survived 2 crashed and looking at them, realized 1 had started to crack. now, these werent the strongest design but they both took a good hit and the pegs acted as frame sliders at the time, so, i'll take it. Few days ago, i drew up beefier versions.. and luckily i have a hookup to get stuff laser cut... so i'll be replacing these this weekend .
old ones:
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/2024-motor/20240306_103718-1-scaled.jpg)
the 'legs' were 0.30" wide, the material was 1/2" 6061. but, spindly.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/2024-motor/20240306_115646-scaled.jpg)
the replacements are also 0.50" 6061 but legs are 1/2" and the layout is better geometry for strength. the holes are all in the same place.
while i -could- pocket the holes, i instead got low head allens so mount them this time.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/2024-motor/image000000.jpg)
hopefully my cyls will be done soon. :whistle:
no joy on the cyls yet so garage time was spent on just refining shit.
got the rearsets on and mocked everything up. they are thick, 2 3/8" plates sandwiched together. might be a bit overkill but the 2 times this bike went down they acted as frame sliders and were only half that.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/2024-motor/rearsets-swingarm/rearsets-swingarm-rearbrake-lc-24_02.jpg)
(previous damage from 2015 :eek: )
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/LC-CRASH-15/DAMAGE/rdcrash_5_zpsjfckitrl.jpg)
one thing that for some reason was SUPER obvious that i never addressed was that the brake lever needed to be flipped over to clear the loams pipes. :busey: totally on me, so, when i was putting the rearsets back together, i did that and its much better. should have done this 10 yrs ago.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/2024-motor/rearsets-swingarm/rearsets-swingarm-rearbrake-lc-24_04.jpg)
had to play around to get the best fitment w stuff, and this seems to be the best.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/2024-motor/rearsets-swingarm/rearsets-swingarm-rearbrake-lc-24_09.jpg)
i also, to compensate for the extra thickness, beveled the nylock and counter sunk the back plate.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/2024-motor/rearsets-swingarm/pegmount_1-rotated.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/2024-motor/rearsets-swingarm/pegmount_2-rotated.jpg)
most of these pics were before final sanding, deburring, etc. I also re-finished the pipes and cleaned up a bunch of just 'dirty' stuff. :toot:
after all that, put a new repro caliper decal on the rear brake and welded a stud in the backside of the brake arm, repainted it, and used a p-clamp to hold the brake hose, a bit cleaner than a zip tie on the outside. lol.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/2024-motor/rearsets-swingarm/rearsets-swingarm-rearbrake-lc-24_11.jpg)
You do such nice work. What is the rod on the top of the silencers?
thanks.
that rod is actually to keep the silencer from moving around. Danny had these pipes and he did that, i think based on a discussion we had.
the last gens of FPPs for example had a square rod along the top of the baffle core for strength, but internal. he did this externally and TBH, it works really well. I probably would have put it underneath, but its 100% function. in 10 years of having these pipes myself, they haven't come at all loose or move 1 bit. they do unbolt as well. it also has a larger stinger diameter and is bent in a bit more than a 'regular' lomas pipe.
TBH im just killing time in the shop since I wont/don't have any major builds/projects and the nitty gritty fussy stuff that I lookat and go 'i need to do that better' on all the bikes is the plan for the year.
of course, a little honda SL100 just fell into my lap over the weekend for free, so i'll probably do that soon. :busey:
I'll update w more pics later but... finally :cool: :whoop:
here's the 1st Fire up. :whoop:
Sounds Great!!!!
Nice! :whoop:
Bike looks and sounds great.
Mark, I sent you a PM. Just want to make sure you are aware of it. Ken
hey. didnt get it that I could see. however, I am out of town on vacay w the wife.
Mark, too fancy of a place to get donuts? :homer: Enjoy the trip
Beignets is New Orleans... Those are good.
IR8D8R
I really like that ding-ding sound of Lomas pipes. I just wish they made something between their Retro pipes and these (too) modern looking ones.
Basically less upkick, internal stinger, and one piece design. Like Spec 2 classics, just a with a larger silencer outer sleeve (60-65 mm od)
last bit, then i think im done, and it's just a cosmetic farkle. The old clutch cover logo was browning.. i have a nice black oem one but figured it play w the laser at work on the old one and made this.
for those that don't know, the rabbit is a benchmark of my family, my last name directly translates to 'hare' in German.
Yes, i know i look like a cast member of the sopranos in most pics, but my father is about as German as you can get. :cheers:
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/2024-motor/lc-clutch-badge_1.jpg)
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/2024-motor/lc-clutch-badge_2.jpg)
Looking great Mark
A "Yamahase" 🙂
Sweet. I just noticed your info on float bowl ILike it :clap:
quick spur of the moment errand running this morning, did well and the kaiser roll breakfast sandwich was delicious. I think its ready for a week in the mts.
(https://2strokeworld.net/wp-content/uploads/LC-HYBRID/GENERAL-PICS/lc-4-29-24.jpeg)
:olaf: :olaf: :olaf: :olaf:
damn right :olaf: :olaf: :olaf: :olaf: to proper kaiser rolls in sc. been down here 44 yrs. its about. fucking. time. :olaf: :olaf: :olaf: :olaf: :dawg:
Nicely done, now all that's left is to enjoy the labor of love.
The pictures don't do it justice. It is hands down one of the best motorcycles I have ever had the privilege of riding. A true testament of the skills of the Blingmaster. :patriot: :patriot:
thanks! you can ride it again in a week.