First I've heard of this.-- https://www.autoblog.com/2019/11/05/harley-davidson-pan-america-bronx-adventure-streetfighter-1250-975-motorcycles/
Interesting. Very interesting. Thx! Looks a LOT different than their other offerings.
I hope it does well but it will probably be half as capable as KTM and twice the price. It will have great chrome skull accessories, no doubt.
It looks HEAVY. That might kill them when there are other offerings like the KTMs etc. I have to hand it to Harley... they seem to be trying break out of their mold from time to time and attract younger/different riders.
I guess that electric bike is out already, been talk of it for years.
livewire is out. then production stopped. the restarted. :whistle: These guys are so behind the 8 ball its like they are on another table all together.
https://www.harley-davidson.com/us/en/motorcycles/livewire.html
I mean, since we are going to talk harley, lets talk. Keep it civil. :patriot:
Personally, i think they will be bought out int he next 10 years, maybe sooner, or crash and fold then get reborn (probably the best option.. Indian, triumph, etc). They are just way too late to the game with these offerings at the price points.
I have tons of friends with Harleys I may kid but don't bash, as they do me, sounds like a vacuum cleaner, or a bumble bee as one said about my ZX900 I had years ago painted yellow and black. That Livewire looks cool, bet is a blast to ride instant throttle response. Wouldn't pay that much for it though.
More potential offerings, the little commuter thing and the flat tracker looking one are interesting. The regular bicycle one might sell too at least looks like they are trying. https://www.harley-davidson.com/us/en/motorcycles/electric.html
Quote from: RDFL on November 07, 2019, 05:08:50 PM
I have tons of friends with Harleys I may kid but don't bash, as they do me, sounds like a vacuum cleaner, or a bumble bee as one said about my ZX900 I had years ago painted yellow and black. That Livewire looks cool, bet is a blast to ride instant throttle response. Wouldn't pay that much for it though.
Ironically and your friends who own Harleys may not be aware of this...Harley made a plant out in Asia so they could make a more affordable product overseas. I recall reading about that a couple of years ago in the New York times. One serious Asian customer was very unhappy about this as had bought several Harleys imported from the US. He felt the brand being made in his country would devalue his investment. I don't really have a dog in that fight but I will say it takes guts for an American company to stay in America. It probably means they would have to forfeit potential sales whilst being true to the name brand. Now I may get called out on this but I really don't think Harley minds being an worldwide company.
I wonder how the Livewire stacks up to a Zero? Which by the way I am absolutely intrigued with the prospect of an electric motorcycle. I think with the way the world is going with tackling the issues of climate change and fossil fuel impact on it then we may all be forced into anything electric powered. Therefore all our gas powered bikes, cars whatever will go the way of the dinosaur. Maybe not five years from now but who knows...it seems 11k scientists say we gotta act fast. However if theres only a handful of places to plug that bike in then what good is it?
Quote from: RDryan on November 07, 2019, 07:12:57 PMNow I may get called out on this but I really don't think Harley minds being an worldwide company.
Those 500 and 750 bikes were aimed at the global market. Harley knows it needs to be global.
I love that new Bronx bike. I loved the Buells, too. My big gripe is that they wasted the original Revolution motor in the fugly V-Rod. That should have been melded into a Sportster chassis to keep that marque relevant. That may come about yet.
Amen to that. I considered a V-Rod. I actually kind of like the early ones. But like you said appearance wise they just don't do it for me.
Just looked up V Rod look pretty good to me. except the goofy mufflers which isn't their fault obviously cats in them.
The V Rod had too much rake, forward controls (a very few had mids), and strange styling. They did handle decent enough and the power was astounding by HD standards.
This new engine is called the Revolution Max. I believe it's an evolution of the original V Rod Revolution.
The V-Rod had a good engine, but not a great chassis.
Harley is making strides in Japan and India. They talk of attracting new and younger riders, but their price point says something else.
I heard the new electric HD leaks oil. :whistle:
Quote from: quocle603 on November 09, 2019, 09:12:28 PM
I heard the new electric HD leaks oil. :whistle:
I was going to say they installed a tank and pump to do so for old time customers.
The short lived recent XR1200 would be the one I would want and seriously thought about getting one before my last bike purchase. They had great ground clearance too as one railed by me one year on the Cherohola Skyway as if I were sitting still! Rider had mad skills and no, I didn't even think about trying to catch him.
Wow. Getting passed by a Harley? Must have been a heck of a rider. Normally I am looking for a way to get around them.
On 68 going from Murphy with my Gold wing I ran into 2 guys going 5 under.
Not many places to pass on 68 so I waited for one and as we got to that place they speed up. Ok. 3 miles later I knew another place was coming so I made it clear I was coming around. They speed up again. Ok I just stayed back. In another moles or so around a rather sharp corner the second guy panicked and ran off the road into a ditch.
I stopped and went to help him. Bike was on top of him and radio blaring. I ALMOST said, can I pass you now? Some how I held back.
Quote from: paul1478 on November 10, 2019, 10:16:05 AM
Wow. Getting passed by a Harley? Must have been a heck of a rider.
Wow. I have similar stories involving Gold wing riders.
One of these and definitely not the typical Harley:
THAT should get the V Rod engine.
Quote from: Evans Ward on November 10, 2019, 12:20:53 PM
One of these and definitely not the typical Harley:
I've been passing one of those parked up on my way to work the last few weeks.
Good looking bike. Still a Harley, but at least it looks good.
nathan ran down johns h1 on a borrowed stock G3. anything is possible. :toot:
https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/motorcycles/2020-harley-davidson-livewire-review-mc-commute/ar-BB107W8T?ocid=spartandhp
was that supposed to be a review?
I still think zero is kicking their ass. :twocents:
I don't see how they can be selling many at 30 grand :umm:
I would buy a Super Tenere before spending my money on a hipster-loving-Harley-Davidson.
These older XR1200 still go for 10k (CAN) around here.
Quote from: Evans Ward on November 10, 2019, 12:20:53 PM
One of these and definitely not the typical Harley:
They DO look good, and I even played with the idea of bying one when they came out, to replace my 1995 Ducati Monster. I even checked one out at the dealer. Pretty disappointing to find out that stuff like footpegs, brake and gear pedals were sloppy on a brand new bike. While still nice and tight on my 15 year old Duc. Go figure. And the weight of that thing.....Must have been several components made out of lead or tungsten. Try comparing the specs to a Monster 1100 Evo....
Plain ridiculous IMHO.....
I went and looked at one of the new 1200's as well, just out of curiosity when they came out. same sort of reaction, and that belt drive drove the exhaust pretty far out as well. Nice from a distance.
even went and looked at the watercooled 500 and 750s when they came out. I actually liked them better overall, but was just a take on the honda shadow of the 80s IMHO.
I really have never seen the value in n HD unless used on the market. neighbor just bought an 06? 1200 sportster for like 2700 bucks, things like new. that, i get.
Looks very similar to this Indian.
https://knoxville.craigslist.org/mcd/d/knoxville-2019-indian-motorcycle-ftr/7077884764.html
IR8D8R
what does?
Quote from: gwcrim on November 07, 2019, 03:13:07 PM
I hope it does well but it will probably be half as capable as KTM and twice the price. It will have great chrome skull accessories, no doubt.
My guess is that it won't just be KTM's offerings that'll make HD's attempt at an adventure bike look rather misguided. But then there's so many folks I've met over here who'd never allow themselves to experience the delights of anything other than an HD :umm:. The only reason for it I've ever been able to come up with is that they're afraid they'll like it, they've no idea what they're missing :metal:
^ there is a lot of truth to that observation. I've experienced that as well when you get talking to HD folks. Not all, but a lot. Its like getting a kid to try vegetables. :dawg:
Harley-Davidson actual buyers are getting older and riding less and less everyday.
Harley sold tons of bikes because they were bad ass to the eye of the buyers, but these badasses are now 55-75yo.
To survive the next decade, Harley has to offer a product appealing to the new and bigger generation, the younger millennials. Problem is, millennials do not value motorcycles that same way boomers and genX do.
I think the new line of Harley is targeting genX, waiting for the millennials to get older and have more free money to spend on useless things.
Millennials want technology, style and low price; I bet the 2020 Yamaha MT-03 will hit that target perfectly.
:twocents:
Quote from: Old Brit on February 21, 2020, 02:55:51 AM
Quote from: gwcrim on November 07, 2019, 03:13:07 PM
I hope it does well but it will probably be half as capable as KTM and twice the price. It will have great chrome skull accessories, no doubt.
My guess is that it won't just be KTM's offerings that'll make HD's attempt at an adventure bike look rather misguided. But then there's so many folks I've met over here who'd never allow themselves to experience the delights of anything other than an HD :umm:. The only reason for it I've ever been able to come up with is that they're afraid they'll like it, they've no idea what they're missing :metal:
I don't know how many times I heard, first thing I did was take those Showa forks off threw them in garbage (said before someone could say they had Japanese forks, because they heard it before) And of course the AMF years weren't real Harleys.
Just found out Kawasaki bought Harley in 2014
No they didn't. That's a myth/urban legend.
Pretty sure I had read that it was a rumor that started as an April Fools joke.
A Harley-Davidson Made In China?! :whistle:
://www.youtube.com/watch?v=14bJb8kaaeo
Quote from: m in sc on February 21, 2020, 06:44:32 AM
^ there is a lot of truth to that observation. I've experienced that as well when you get talking to HD folks. Not all, but a lot. Its like getting a kid to try vegetables. :dawg:
There you go, the perfect analogy :clap: 8)
The other I should add is that my 2 best USA buddies of 20yrs+ (50 & 60 yr old life long HD riders) couldn't believe how my Ducati Diavel rode when they tried it, it absolutely blew their tits off. So much so the Old Guy has owned one for the past 5yrs :P
Quote from: Alain2 on February 21, 2020, 09:54:22 AM
Harley-Davidson actual buyers are getting older and riding less and less everyday.
Harley sold tons of bikes because they were bad ass to the eye of the buyers, but these badasses are now 55-75yo.
To survive the next decade, Harley has to offer a product appealing to the new and bigger generation, the younger millennials. Problem is, millennials do not value motorcycles that same way boomers and genX do.
I think the new line of Harley is targeting genX, waiting for the millennials to get older and have more free money to spend on useless things.
Millennials want technology, style and low price; I bet the 2020 Yamaha MT-03 will hit that target perfectly.
:twocents:
I'll pass that on at the dealer meeting this summer. ::)
We moved 5 bikes out the door on Friday. It's a tough market.......for everyone in this business. However bikes can be sold if your staff is up to the challenge. Everyone is waiting for things to return to the balloon times of the early 2000s. Nah that's going to be a long time if at all. Personally I think the current level is sustainable and boom times are too much to expect considering we're still recovering from that mess from 2007-9. No one will admit nor accept it though.
Shit I bought my first new Harley since 1986. First new motorcycle since 2004.
just a snapshot observation from yesterday
i rode up to the local honda/kaw/suzuki dealer in rock hill saturday to show the sales manager the 2t grom when i went up to buy a filter for the CB1100 ( i actually sold him an r5 like 6 years ago). i let him ride it and he came back giggling like a little kid.
However, they were wheeling bikes out of the showroom like they were giving them away for free while i was there. Im not sure, but they seem to be kicking it pretty strong over there. always do.
side note, I live by the local harley dealer in rock hill, its super nice dealership (COX). I think there were 5 cars out front yesterday when i went by maybe 30 minutes later heading tot eh QT, while I barley had room to park at RockHill powersports. :twocents:
Like I said you have to be able to work a tough market. Is there a tougher market then West Virginia? Prob'ly but you'll have to search. The Japanese bikes aren't high dollar toys thus a different sell. Seems like everyone want to see me out of work via Harley's failure. However I don't see it happening any time soon.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/topstories/harley-ceo-levatich-steps-down/ar-BB10xsmm?ocid=spartandhp
Quote from: thatguy on February 23, 2020, 10:34:58 AM
Like I said you have to be able to work a tough market. Is there a tougher market then West Virginia? Prob'ly but you'll have to search. The Japanese bikes aren't high dollar toys thus a different sell. Seems like everyone want to see me out of work via Harley's failure. However I don't see it happening any time soon.
I for one wouldn't want to see you out of work and honestly can't see Harley being anywhere near as ignorant or stupid as the British motorcycle manufactures were back in the 70's. Yes the days of dealerships the size of a Holiday Inn maybe numbered but they're trying to move with modern market demands. It's a fact that their most loyal customer base is literally dying but at least they haven't stuck their head in the sand like ALL of the dozens of British manufacturers did when exactly the same thing happened to them. Harley have done a brilliant job at stretching it out across an extra generation or 2 but it's time for a radical rethink. Who would ever of thought Ducati would offer us anything more than 2 cylinders huh ?
Quote from: Old Brit on March 01, 2020, 02:28:46 AM
Quote from: thatguy on February 23, 2020, 10:34:58 AM
Like I said you have to be able to work a tough market. Is there a tougher market then West Virginia? Prob'ly but you'll have to search. The Japanese bikes aren't high dollar toys thus a different sell. Seems like everyone want to see me out of work via Harley's failure. However I don't see it happening any time soon.
I for one wouldn't want to see you out of work and honestly can't see Harley being anywhere near as ignorant or stupid as the British motorcycle manufactures were back in the 70's. Yes the days of dealerships the size of a Holiday Inn maybe numbered but they're trying to move with modern market demands. It's a fact that the last generation of "I'd rather walk than ride anything else" customer base is literally dying but at least they haven't stuck their head in the sand like ALL of the dozens of British manufacturers did when exactly the same thing happened to them. Harley have done a brilliant job at stretching it out across an extra generation or 2 but it's time for a radical rethink. Who would ever of thought Ducati would offer us anything more than 2 cylinders huh ?