I have my 1975 RD250 converted over to a 350 fresh bore with Jim Lomas street retro pipes and an Economy Cycle crossover tube (large fuel line style) and manifolds. As well I converted her to electronic ignition with a Vintage Smoke Dyna setup at 1.8 btdc (1.81 left and like 1.79 right. As close as I could get).
The air filter that came out of the bike from stock was unbaffled and the jets were 120 mains on a 30 pilot. Stock needle and 0-8 needle jet.
I replaced the main jet with a 190 main to start , left 30 pilot in it. Then ran it around the block a few times. It seemed kinda all over the place. Initially started fine after rebuild, but seemed to not like idling the other day. Turned idle screws up half a turn and raised idle to about 1400. Still stalls on occasion. Tried setting air screw to 1 and 3/4 out from 1 and 1/4, still died when cold. Seems to idle fine when hot.
I know I made a lot of changes to the bike all at once so it's a rough start with tons of new info, but the main thing was it seemed to be running rough, surging at slow speeds every now and then, not taking throttle well. Carbs were synced before taking off bike and a quick check with my finger inside carb bells showed they matched each other at full throttle when I put them back on. Top end felt lax as well.
I have to pull plugs to see but I wonder if its lean? 190 seemed a good spot to start since it is 5 main sizes over stock.
This is cross posted in ac rd club. Suggestions so far have been larger 35 pilot and main jet, and plug the EC crossover. Also pressure test motor. Which I might be able to do but for now I'll check with propane or ether around motor.
I'm no expert but I think you are way lean, if you do the dave f mod you would be closer to 200 main. If your carbs are stock I think you might need to go bigger, Chuck rebuilt a 350 at the gap last year with pipes and filters and I think he was in the 300's on main. Someone on hear can chime in . I will also say I have the jl pipes (rd400) and they scavenge ALOT. You will most certainly need more main. Cheers -Ian
Sounds lean to me too but how did it run before, or is this the first time running it since the 350 conversion and the mods? Are your carbs clean? Have you had the needle jets out and are they clean? There are many things that can make it run like that.
Quote from: Jspooner on March 20, 2019, 07:31:34 PM
Sounds lean to me too but how did it run before, or is this the first time running it since the 350 conversion and the mods? Are your carbs clean? Have you had the needle jets out and are they clean? There are many things that can make it run like that.
This was the first time running it after all the mods were performed. I did run it on the center stand on the points once the pipes were on just to hear it for the first time, but switched it over to electronic the next day.
I cleaned the carbs (chem-dip, rinse, air gun) last summer and rode it. Ran the bike through with sta-bil, then ran the carbs dry before storing it. When I did the work, I looked over the carb quickly and the jets weren't clogged, so I swapped the main jets to the 190 and put them back in the bike. Since the carbs will be coming off again, I'll dunk them in the chem dip. As far as the air jet, I always blow the passages out after dipping the carbs, but they are un-modified and perhaps something came dislodged?
The multiple carb mods I'm reading about are a bit of voodoo to me, as I know I would botch that kinda job with my mickey mouse set of tools. So if they require it in terms of reliability, perhaps I can ship them off to someone.
The EC manifolds were a very tight fit inside the reed cages, so I put a thin coat of Permatex case-half sealer on both sides of the gasket and one side of the carb boot to ensure a seal. Doesn't mean it worked I guess lol, but I was in a hurry as usual to hear the thing run.
Quote from: Striker1423 on March 20, 2019, 07:52:15 PM
I cleaned the carbs (chem-dip, rinse, air gun) last summer and rode it. Ran the bike through with sta-bil, then ran the carbs dry before storing it. When I did the work, I looked over the carb quickly and the jets weren't clogged, so I swapped the main jets to the 190 and put them back in the bike. Since the carbs will be coming off again, I'll dunk them in the chem dip. As far as the air jet, I always blow the passages out after dipping the carbs, but they are un-modified and perhaps something came dislodged?
To properly clean the carbs you must dissamble them and remove the jets, then clean them with parts cleaner (e.g. Chem-Dip), then rinse and blow out with air gun. Dunking alone does not do much. The pilot and needle jet are usually the things that clog up first. I used to use a toothbrush on mine with Chem-Dip before I got my ultrasonic cleaner. :twocents:
Quote from: SoCal250 on March 20, 2019, 08:25:28 PM
Quote from: Striker1423 on March 20, 2019, 07:52:15 PM
I cleaned the carbs (chem-dip, rinse, air gun) last summer and rode it. Ran the bike through with sta-bil, then ran the carbs dry before storing it. When I did the work, I looked over the carb quickly and the jets weren't clogged, so I swapped the main jets to the 190 and put them back in the bike. Since the carbs will be coming off again, I'll dunk them in the chem dip. As far as the air jet, I always blow the passages out after dipping the carbs, but they are un-modified and perhaps something came dislodged?
To properly clean the carbs you must dissamble them and remove the jets, then clean them with parts cleaner (e.g. Chem-Dip), then rinse and blow out with air gun. Dunking alone does not do much. The pilot and needle jet are usually the things that clog up first. I used to use a toothbrush on mine with Chem-Dip before I got my ultrasonic cleaner. :twocents:
Oh im sorry I did disassemble them fully. Should have mentioned that.
I would pressure test it also. I found a couple of little leaks at the crossover tube and at the base gasket when I put mine together. A little cheap insurance and peace of mind.
If I remember right you live fairly close to me. If you can get the bike to me sometime next month I'd be happy to work on it for you. I also sent you a text.
To be clear in my mind...are you still on the stock airbox or did you use something different?
I always do the primary needle jet conversion if running a crossover manifold system.
I never use bleed needle jet unless using stock manifolds.
Chuck
Quote from: SUPERTUNE on March 22, 2019, 09:53:48 PM
To be clear in my mind...are you still on the stock airbox or did you use something different?
I always do the primary needle jet conversion if running a crossover manifold system.
I never use bleed needle jet unless using stock manifolds.
Chuck
This is a stock airbox with a UNI foam filter freshly cleaned and oiled. I dropped the main jets to 170's and the bike runs much better. It was suggested to me to try smaller jets and I was only convinced when I took the bike out on a 45F day and it ran much better than it did when it was 60F a week back. Denser air when its colder.
Now the primary needle jet conversion requires carb modifications correct? I would have used my stock boots if that was the case, but they are old and were giving me fits so I bought what I could find, and the crossover tube boots were the only reliable new ones I found at the time.
yeah with a stock box WITH LID ON you will be in the 155-165 range if i remember correctly. with lid off gets you in the 180-195 range. (estimated) . you can always plug the crossover for initial setup if you wish, but not nec. .02
Quote from: m in sc on March 25, 2019, 11:02:19 AM
yeah with a stock box WITH LID ON you will be in the 155-165 range if i remember correctly. with lid off gets you in the 180-195 range. (estimated) . you can always plug the crossover for initial setup if you wish, but not nec. .02
That seems about right since I can only imagine how this will run on a 90 degree day this summer. I'm used to snowmobiles and when you put aftermarket pipes on them when its super cold, they really need extra fuel. I guess I was just over-zealous with the jets. Plus it probably didn't help that I blew my snowmobile up this winter on a 5 degree day in the Upper Peninsula. Must have been a bit paranoid.
OK, so I wound up with a 160 main jet and a 1/4 inch hole in the airbox lid. The thing rips but still feels a little flat in the mid-range. Before adding thew hole the bike was kinda all over the place. So, it's a lot more responsive now. I was having so much fun on the bike that I went for a long ride and even ran it down the freeway. Ballsy? Yes. Especially since I wasn't 100 percent sure of the jetting. But, that brings me to the theory of plug chops and what my best course of action would be to do one.
I don't live in an area where long stretches of road are safe to attempt high-speed plug chops. But, after farting around on the bike all day and running it home, this is what I found the left cylinder plug looked like. It was a brand new plug. The right looks very similar. My mechanic friend told me that it was high-speed glazing caused by too hot of a cylinder temp. I'd like others thoughts on this.
https://i.imgur.com/6Y3lp8v.jpg
I would say slightly too lean and wind the oil off a tad, ( that's just a bit more than a Knat's cock)
Well, this is the seemingly last thing that's bugging me on this bike. Not sure what this noise is, but it was making it last year on just the 250 as well. When warm it's got this rattle from the clutch side that gets the loudest when good and hot. Sounds like a bag of marbles. I figure it could be the clutch is just worn out, but I don't quite know. Again for the sake of knowledge the crank is new, etc. Clutch doesn't slip and the noise isn't really heard when at speed. But that is probably just from the wind noise. :vroom:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhU0yL9ymYE
Sounds like a rattly piston to me.
I am by no means an expert but sounds like a piston to me also.
If this is not what it is I need to fix my bike to because it sounds about like that just not quite as loud.
Pipes sound great by the way !
So I suppose its possible the bore job was done too loose. But on the same side as when it was the 250? I'm really over this bike if that's the case. Last thing I need is a piston exploding in another piece of equipment I have.
Striker, What pistons did you use?
Do you know what piston to wall clearance it was bored to?
If using Pro-X pistons you have to buff off the coating off the measurement point of skirts to get a proper measurement of the piston,
most shops that have no idea about RD's make this mistake and bore the cylinders too big.
Now you have a rattly topend after breakin when the coating wears off. It can add .0008 to .0012 of added clearance if you don't do this when boring for finish size.
Chuck
It will still live for a while even if this happens. Just warm up the engine good before hard wide open running.
Chuck
Chuck,
Here's a few pictures I took when I did the swap over. He marked both pistons and jugs with his measurements. They are Wiseco Pistons.
https://imgur.com/gallery/tIKb2CV
If you want good results with this bike making power and running good, get rid of the stock airbox, do a primary needle jet conversion on the stock carbs.
This squish chamber is really bad design when stock also.
Go read some old internet articles about modifying the top end for proper modern head chambers designs.
So sad that a lot of this stuff I posted about this is gone with the old forum... :(
I did a whole thread on John's RD250 to 350 build I did last year....
Chuck
Quote from: Striker1423 on April 08, 2019, 10:09:10 PM
Chuck,
Here's a few pictures I took when I did the swap over. He marked both pistons and jugs with his measurements. They are Wiseco Pistons.
https://imgur.com/gallery/tIKb2CV
Bad link...
Wiseco pistons do make noise, so that is not a problem...
If it's quiet, that's a problem!!
C
I just finished another RD350 build for Dan Sawyer yesterday and it rips.
I will have to start posting everything I did on here with his RD350.
Send me a PM and we can talk...no need to give up. I can help!
Chuck
Quote from: Striker1423 on April 08, 2019, 10:09:10 PM
Chuck,
Here's a few pictures I took when I did the swap over. He marked both pistons and jugs with his measurements. They are Wiseco Pistons.
https://imgur.com/gallery/tIKb2CV
OK, the links works now...I can see your machinist was in a hurry and mis-wrote the sizes on the cylinders.
He wrote 65.01 on cyl. A and 65.02 on cyl. B That is not correct I'm hoping...
I'm sure he meant to write 64.51 for A and 64.52 for B
At those #'s your right on the $$ for piston clearances @ .0031 in (.078mm)
Just you can't make a mistake with jetting and tuning setup. At this piston to wall you have no wiggle room if your running it on a hard full pace run.
Start rich until you see about 50 miles or more on it to breakin the pistons.
On my jobs I start about the same.
Get timing to 1.8mm to 1.7mm
Use fresh *93 fuel, do not use old fuel. I like 6 weeks or less with tuning RD's (IN A SEALED CAN!)
Ethanol based pump fuels will suck humidity right out of the air and turn to water in your bowls!
Pour some in a coffee cup, let it sit in Florida 15-20 mins and the whole bottom will have water in it!!
Chuck
Your main problem is you need to cap the crossover on the manifolds!!
Use the carbs as they were intended to be used with stock bleed needle jets and air box...Stock manifolds did not have a crossover other than some euro RD400's but they have special needle jets in them from Yamaha to compensate for a crossover tube.
If you want to keep the crossover tube (or in my case on my builds I use my TSR/Barlow designed boost bottle) you should go to a Y boot air cleaner and do the primary needle jet conversion (known as the Dave F mod)
I can do all the mods to the carbs with a full rebuild, this can be in the $150-200 range with shipping (Never use any old jetting parts in the carbs, these are over 40 years old and who knows who's poked what at any of the jets and how much wear the needle jets and needles have)
Chuck
Quote from: Striker1423 on April 08, 2019, 04:53:05 PM
Well, this is the seemingly last thing that's bugging me on this bike. Not sure what this noise is, but it was making it last year on just the 250 as well. When warm it's got this rattle from the clutch side that gets the loudest when good and hot. Sounds like a bag of marbles. I figure it could be the clutch is just worn out, but I don't quite know. Again for the sake of knowledge the crank is new, etc. Clutch doesn't slip and the noise isn't really heard when at speed. But that is probably just from the wind noise. :vroom:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhU0yL9ymYE
Clutch hubs do wear out the cushions in the hubs and I have replaced a few of them.
Have to grind off the factory rivets to get the hub separated from the gear, tap some threads in the rivets holes and use new rubber bushings and special flat headed screws.
Ebay here for the cushions.
Chuck
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Yamaha-banshee-clutch-basket-cushing-bushing/322387510046?hash=item4b0fcb031e:g:Q2kAAOSwiONYK1j-&frcectupt=true (https://www.ebay.com/itm/Yamaha-banshee-clutch-basket-cushing-bushing/322387510046?hash=item4b0fcb031e:g:Q2kAAOSwiONYK1j-&frcectupt=true)
I figured the clutch basket was pretty hooped when it had 6mm of forward and backward play in it. So, I looked and can get the dampers and a new basket that takes tapered Allen screws on yambits for around 100 bucks. Seems reasonable. Would suck if I did the work and it still made that noise lol. But I'm already so far in the hole here it's a do it or make the bike go away kinda thing at this point.
Quote from: Striker1423 on April 09, 2019, 10:23:35 AM
I figured the clutch basket was pretty hooped when it had 6mm of forward and backward play in it. So, I looked and can get the dampers and a new basket that takes tapered Allen screws on yambits for around 100 bucks. Seems reasonable. Would suck if I did the work and it still made that noise lol. But I'm already so far in the hole here it's a do it or make the bike go away kinda thing at this point.
Yeah I know... I see it everyday, people buy wrong parts and modifying from stock with no knowledge of what they are doing or why.
Internet can be too confusing. I try to be very specific on how to modify RD's to get the results we want.
Believe me, just hit 59 and started doing this RD stuff at 19 with a brand new '79 Daytona, went back to a '77 RD400 and won a AMA 410 production championship in '80. Talk about skinny...I was very skinny then. :eek:
Here's from about 1984 at Rockingham.
(https://photos.imageevent.com/supertune/earlyrdracingpictures/icons/410%20prod.serious2.jpg)
(https://photos.imageevent.com/supertune/earlyrdracingpictures/icons/410%20prod.peace3.jpg)
So, when I turn the bike over with the side cover off when the bike overcomes compression and I spin it over a but more by grabbing the clutch it makes a very slight clank noise. This is just turning it over slowly. Not sure it isn't the gears meshing. So I'll try putting a bit of lube on the gears and record what it sounds like.
The only thing I can think is the bottom end not being happy. I checked the rod when I put the new top end on and it didn't have any up and down play. So perhaps it's the piston making noise after all. I'll update this tonight when I'm home and can get a better look.
On a Kawasaki triple that would indicate loose clutch rivet bolts and/or worn out rubber bushings.
I haven't experienced that with an RD but then I haven't ridden an RD in about 15 years. That will change as I have a collection of RD's to work on.
The clutch basket has play in it, but it is stiff and takes some force to get the basket to move back and forth (in rotation). I am positive the bushings are destroyed due to the ability to grab it and rotate it apart from the gear, but the clutch basket moves very stiff. If I grasp the top and bottom of the basket as if I'm checking a ball joint or similar on a car, I cannot make the basket move. So the rivets appear tight enough to prevent that axis of movement. So I dont really see it as the source of my noise.
The noise I'm describing seems to show up only when rolling the motor over by hand, say with the kickstarter, or grasping the clutch. I only did this slowly to try and pinpoint the source. Either the gears are unloading and meshing, thus making a noise or maybe I have an issue with the new crank? It is a vito's crank.
EDIT:
Here's a video of the noise when I kick the motor over and showing how much the clutch moves.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FJPh4_6sKw&t=1s
I just did two like that. Your cush rubbers are completely shot and need to be replaced.
Remove the rivets and clean up the mess inside.
You can tap the basket 6mm x 1mm and use countersunk screws and loctite them in place. Banshee rubbers are available on the web for around $20-$25 and fit. They are the same as RD rubbers.
There are awesome forged aluminum baskets on Ebay that come as a bolt on after you get the old one off. They're around 150-170$ I did mine and it is a solid upgrade! Comes with new cushes and everything you need!
Quote from: 2 Stroke Jamoke on April 12, 2019, 11:27:16 AM
There are awesome forged aluminum baskets on Ebay that come as a bolt on after you get the old one off. They're around 150-170$ I did mine and it is a solid upgrade! Comes with new cushes and everything you need!
Link?
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F282584662669. This is the exact one I used, it is very nicely made and machined
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F131790763254 here is another priced lower, they're made for high hp banshee so they will easily handle a RD
OK, so here's 2 videos with the spark plugs taken out, one with the clutch in and one without just turning the crank by hand. Aside from the transmission making a little noise, I'm curious what else it might be. My vote is steering towards pistons rattling around. :bang:
Vid1
https://youtu.be/blhFaJIcYGQ
Vid2
https://youtu.be/0VXhPs0cz3Y
Sounds like air being drawn through the reeds.
Pull them off and see if it goes away.
1st vid: Without a doubt... that squeak sound is reeds!
2nd vid: The input shaft in first gear play is normal due to only having 3 engagement clogs on first gear set.
The less play in second is the 2nd gear set has 6 engagement clogs. Fine.
Piston rocking rattle sounds normal to me, so all good there.
The input shaft does sound a little loud, so I have 2 engines at the shop in the same stage and I'll check them more closely,
PM me your address and I can send you another input double row bearing as I have lots of spares.
The Bad: Primary crank seal is in backwards. You can tell by seeing the nubs on the seal, they are there to use as a setting guide against the outer race of the main bearing to position the seal and keep it squared to the shaft.
Chuck
Ok so I replaced the clutch basket with a billet banshee one. Was surprisingly easy to do, and put new dampers in it. It had 6 small dampers and 2 large ones inside it. The two large ones were hollow in the center like a doughnut and one of them was cracked in half and in pieces.
Split the cases and will have a good look at everything before reassembling. Took video of piston movement relative to the bore here: https://youtu.be/lYoi0aQmWls
Seems a little loose but without getting measurements I wont know for sure. Have a few small scrapes near the exhaust ports but if the 250 top end is any tell, it seems normal. Pistons show no discernible break in patterns and still have that corduroy feel on the piston walls. But 50 miles on a top end wouldn't expect much.
I have a fresh bored Wiseco cylinder I'll mock up and look at the piston rock to compare to...
Ring gaps will be a telltale too.
C
I'm curious to see what Chuck comes back with on the Wisecos. They are more "slappy" than cast pistons. I had noticeably more chatter when I ran a set of those on my 400. Yours seem to have a lot of play though.
Sorry to not be able to check today...
I'm a 2 stroke specialist and have been slammed with jetski work too, with the Deals Gap meet next weekend I got really busy today.
Chuck
Chuck did get back with me over the phone and my measurements were within spec of a good bore job (ring end gaps of .017 and .018 respectively). Also, he shared a short video with me that showed very similar piston rocking with his Wiseco setup. So, I aim to clean the top end thoroughly with Marvel Mystery oil and it will be ready for re-assembly once everything else is cleaned and re-oiled. My local dealer didn't have Belray Trans-saver as I would normally run, but was recommended Lucas 80w as a good alternative. So I grabbed two of the Lucas quarts and began the process of cleaning the trans gears and ensuring they moved correctly.
So far the driven portion of the transmission (clutch input) is fine. No gears were seized to the shaft. To note, based on the manual exploded view, 4th gear does have a bit of wobble to it (when grasped and twisted back and forth). Nothing major, but it's there. Next up, a good cleaning and re-oil of the little needle bearing had it spinning smoothly with no notches or gravel feeling to note. I don't see a reason to replace it. Pictures here: https://imgur.com/gallery/emw0lyu (https://imgur.com/gallery/emw0lyu)
I've just started tearing into the output (sprocket) side of the transmission. There's a lot more going on with this side, but I'm using my repair manual, layout and pictures to ensure I re-assemble it the correct way after checking and cleaning it. Once clean I'm using Reynolds wrap to keep it clean until I re-assemble.
I bought a large plastic tub for $8.00 and a gallon of Mineral Spirits ($13) from Lowes to scrub the cases down in. So, I don't miss anything and ensure I re-assemble this bike correctly this time. I really don't want to have to repeat this again for a while lol. So, on that note I'm just chuggin' along.
I have often made "Dip Tanks" out of a plastic 5-gallon paint can. I use low odor mineral spirits & generic Dexron type ATF. Usually 1 qt. ATF added to 1 gal. mineral spirits. Cleans fairly well & the parts have a bit of lube to protect them after the mineral spirits evaporates.
The parts have finally shown up and I've been scrubbing the crap out of the case halves to make them as clean as I can get. Then I have the carbs to take apart and convert. So, quite a bit of work left to do, but I'm close to putting the cases back together.
Well it's back together and I'm chasing after an air leak near the carbs. I'm headed to bed, but maybe I can take a better look at it tomorrow.
I worked a late night on a RD350 on premix one time and forgot to plug the oil injection holes!! :umm:
Big air leak...
I use heavy grease on the reed gaskets and use 1211 3Bond silicone to glue the manifold on the reed cage, I never trust the manifolds to seal when dry, some use another set of gaskets there...
Chuck
Chuck,
I used the Permatex Motoseal before I took the motor back apart and it seemed to work fine. But was gummy. So, I left it off this time. I just ordered some 1211 off Amazon. Should be here tomorrow.
On another note, I can kinda see why John has these manifolds on sale. They are very pliable and dont screw down very well. The corners bend in and the cap screws just wont tighten well. I thought about buying a small 1/8" sheet of aluminum and cutting out two pieces of square covers that would fit over the manifolds before I screw them down. Kinda like a big washer. There was something similar on the old Kawasaki G3 I had that covered up the carburetor side of the case. The cable ran through a large chunk of rubber that sealed off the intake. Strange design sideways carb and all, but it worked.
This a decent idea or should I just buy another set of manifolds? Banshee ones or something.
i havent had an issue with them, they have the aluminum in there int he flange..... i mean, only supposed to be like 7-8 ft/lbs. i always use a lockwasher under them. :twocents:
So mine tighten up on 3 corners but the last corner has no support inside it. Kinda like the aluminum had the corner cut off or something. I would have to check with my small needle torque wrench, but the thing wont tighten. Maybe a thicker washer is worth a shot.
... sure the threads in the cyl are ok? (just spitballing here)
Quote from: SUPERTUNE on May 22, 2019, 08:09:24 AM
I worked a late night on a RD350 on premix one time and forgot to plug the oil injection holes!! :umm:
Big air leak...
Sorry to hi-jack but what do you close off the oil injection holes with?
Frank,
Whatever works. Some people glue them shut. A lot of people simply glue the injection nozzles shut and leave them in so they dont ruin the carbs for future injection use.
Mark, to clarify the bolts tighten OK in the cylinder, just the manifold on that corner folds over like it's made of rubber only with No support inside it.
WEIRD. MUST BE A DEFECTIVE ONE THEN. sorry caps.
as far as plugging holes, ive used an m4 tap and stuck a screw in there but its not reversible. :twocents: :science:
I use the OEM Banshee 31K manifolds, at $64 a set for Yamaha quality i'ts a no brainer for me...
To plug RD oil injection holes in the carbs, use a 6-32 tap and about 3/8 length philips screw with some Yamabond.
If you do this you can go back to the stock oil nipple with some red loctite and no issues.
Chuck
^ nice. thats a .138" dia. way better than my suggestion. Noted. :toot:
Well I ordered the banshee manifolds, crossover tube and clips from the local yamaha shop. Was a bit more than I anticipated. But, hopefully that helps. The threebond 1211 should be here today.
Hoping this solves the issues. But will I need to cut off the reed stuffer on the back of them? Hiw does that effect the reeds working?
Yes, will need to cut off the stuffer on the back of the manifolds. I use a new razer blade then grind the rest flush with a sanding roll on my porting grinder.
I also port the reed cages to match the Banshee manifold too while I'm in there.
No stuffer makes better mid to top end power with a slight loss of very low throttle. If using the YZ125 fiberglass reeds that makes it almost a even trade out. Stock metal reeds are a bit stiffer than the YZ modern reeds.
Chuck
Quote from: SUPERTUNE on May 23, 2019, 09:21:37 AM
Yes, will need to cut off the stuffer on the back of the manifolds. I use a new razer blade then grind the rest flush with a sanding roll on my porting grinder.
I also port the reed cages to match the Banshee manifold too while I'm in there.
No stuffer makes better mid to top end power with a slight loss of very low throttle. If using the YZ125 fiberglass reeds that makes it almost a even trade out. Stock metal reeds are a bit stiffer than the YZ modern reeds.
Chuck
So I can handle a razor knife and some sanding but porting reed cages sounds a bit over my bull in a China shop tendencies. Am I looking at any negatives to not doing this? Cavitation comes to mind. But this isn't a jet ski impeller lol. So prolly a bad comparison.
just match it up to the cage opening as best as you can. :toot: :cheerleader:
So I took the bike out yesterday and went for a rip. The needle clip set to 4th position, 210 main jet and a 35 pilot. :celebrate: Chuck and Joe weren't kidding. Those Wisecos slapping away is so metallic and loud but it ran great and plugs are pretty close. Right plug still holds onto more burnt oil than the left but who knows. Could be the pump?
She runs well. However, idle is a bit up and down. The air screws are at 1.25 turns out. Might try just backing them off to 1 turn. It started getting cold about 630pm so I think it was in the mid 50s. This definitely made the idle and take off a bit worse. So I'm thinking it's a bit lean at that setting.
I tried a few high speed runs and the last little bit of throttle caused some hesitations. It just sputtered a bit. If I backed off that last 1/8th of throttle a little bit it accelerates fine. So, perhaps it still a bit lean when cold? I'll have to see when its above 75 or so.
But I put 150 miles on and had a lot of fun. :)
https://imgur.com/gallery/SMcsgiB
So I checked my 2T oil level and it appears I used just about a half tank of oil in around 2 to two and a half tanks of gas. I had overfilled it at the dealer where my buddy works and spent a few minutes wiping oil off the concrete... oops. But, I filled the gas tank up and rode it to around a half tank, then finished my work to it (intake boots, carb mods as listed) before taking it out this last time and filling the gas tank up twice, with each time around 2 gallons of gas. Does this sound about right? I do have the pump delayed 3mm. Shimmed to .2mm. Makes decent smoke at idle, and atomized oil is at the end of the pipes as expected.
Just curious what you guys usually get tanks of gas to oil fill ups? I heard somewhere usually around 7 tanks to one tank of oil? I know mileage will vary depending on the bike.
Quote from: Striker1423 on June 03, 2019, 11:01:27 AM
So I took the bike out yesterday and went for a rip. The needle clip set to 4th position, 210 main jet and a 35 pilot. :celebrate: Chuck and Joe weren't kidding. Those Wisecos slapping away is so metallic and loud but it ran great and plugs are pretty close. Right plug still holds onto more burnt oil than the left but who knows. Could be the pump?
She runs well. However, idle is a bit up and down. The air screws are at 1.25 turns out. Might try just backing them off to 1 turn. It started getting cold about 630pm so I think it was in the mid 50s. This definitely made the idle and take off a bit worse. So I'm thinking it's a bit lean at that setting.
I tried a few high speed runs and the last little bit of throttle caused some hesitations. It just sputtered a bit. If I backed off that last 1/8th of throttle a little bit it accelerates fine. So, perhaps it still a bit lean when cold? I'll have to see when its above 75 or so.
But I put 150 miles on and had a lot of fun. :)
https://imgur.com/gallery/SMcsgiB
Too rich on the main jets still...210 are a bit big, go to 200's.
Quote from: Striker1423 on June 05, 2019, 10:59:45 PM
So I checked my 2T oil level and it appears I used just about a half tank of oil in around 2 to two and a half tanks of gas. I had overfilled it at the dealer where my buddy works and spent a few minutes wiping oil off the concrete... oops. But, I filled the gas tank up and rode it to around a half tank, then finished my work to it (intake boots, carb mods as listed) before taking it out this last time and filling the gas tank up twice, with each time around 2 gallons of gas. Does this sound about right? I do have the pump delayed 3mm. Shimmed to .2mm. Makes decent smoke at idle, and atomized oil is at the end of the pipes as expected.
Just curious what you guys usually get tanks of gas to oil fill ups? I heard somewhere usually around 7 tanks to one tank of oil? I know mileage will vary depending on the bike.
I thinks that is about right on oil usage.
Did you use the 250 primary gears and stock RD 15/40 gearing?
Chuck
Yes I used the 250 gearing, oil pump, stock sprockets 15/40, etc.
So I checked the bike for any air leaks around the carb boots etc and I dont have any but when the bike is good and hot it idles up and down a few hundred rpm. Usually low to around 900 or 1000 then back up to 1500. Tried setting air screws from 1-1/4 out to 3/4 and it sorta seemed to help. But not much. Could be my imagination, but I have the 35 pilot in it. The one issue I have is the left head pipe keeps leaking at the head. So, I'm going to have to find a replacement o-ring for it and see if I cant get it to stay sealed. Even red rtv won't keep the seal together.
It was more pronounced on the way home and it felt as if I was losing a cylinder at some stop lights. I'll pull the plugs again once it cools off.
Check the charging system and battery voltage at idle with lights on and hit the brake lever.
Weak stock charging systems and bad battery can cause issues your speaking of.
I always use LED's in RD400 tail lights for this draw on the system, also because the 400's have twin tail light bulbs.
The Philips are the best ones I like...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00HWS7XGW/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&psc=1 (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00HWS7XGW/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&psc=1)
Chuck
Swapped the main jet to a 200 and clip to middle position. Went to the O'reilly's and found a few O-rings that should fit the head pipe and fix my exhaust leak. Will report back tomorrow what charging system is doing. Last I checked at around 3k the system was putting out 14.2 volts or so. Battery was on the tender all winter and kept topped up. Holds a solid 12 volts, but could be failing.
Quote from: Striker1423 on June 09, 2019, 11:52:39 PM
Swapped the main jet to a 200 and clip to middle position. Went to the O'reilly's and found a few O-rings that should fit the head pipe and fix my exhaust leak. Will report back tomorrow what charging system is doing. Last I checked at around 3k the system was putting out 14.2 volts or so. Battery was on the tender all winter and kept topped up. Holds a solid 12 volts, but could be failing.
Check at idle also...with lights and brake on.
I'll check the idle hopefully today when I get home. I'm having a hell of a time getting the exhaust to seal.up on the left side. I believe its leaking past the slip on pipe at the manifold. But I'll take it back apart and try to fix it yet again. My question is, can I use exhaust putty or something to seal this up? I have to get some copper rtv for the manifold to ensure it doesn't leak there, but as far as the slip on my new grainger orings aren't cutting the mustard and red rtv didnt work as well as it does on my sled.
Might need to just get better exhaust next year. This ones a bit finicky.
Also, I was running low on oil so when I went on a group ride my friend at the dealer said he had a written off barrel of Yamalube TCW3 watercraft oil and said it would work ok. I put it in the bike and its definitely a lot cleaner burning, but should I switch it back to something else when this tanks empty?
The internet has me worried about it being an outboard oil, not an AC bike oil. Seemed just fine and I didn't have to wipe SkiDoo synthetic spooge off the end of the pipe after the ride. That skidoo sled stuff is gross and smokey as hell. Even coated the back of my shirt and my license plate with oil Haha.
try to seal your pipes with 'the right stuff' if you can.
I convert all the oil pump RD's I setup to Outboard oil!
Quicksilver synthetic blend from Walmart at $30 gallon.
https://www.walmart.com/ip/Mercury-Quicksilver-Synthetic-Blend-2-Cycle-Outboard-Oil/17165294 (https://www.walmart.com/ip/Mercury-Quicksilver-Synthetic-Blend-2-Cycle-Outboard-Oil/17165294)
Chuck
I was able to purchase two gallons of yamalube watercraft 2T from the dealer for less than 20 bucks. So I'm set for the summer. :)
So, I tried a few different silicones as well as new o-rings from grainger with no real luck keeping the exhaust in the left slip-on. My question is, do any of you know of a teflon tape, or silicone tape, maybe even a viton tape that's thin enough to be wrapped to where the pipe just presses on? I'm thinking if I can get the thing to seal up enough I can finish it off with a bit of the right stuff to ensure it wont leak. I did not try chemical teflon tape because I don't know what kind of temperatures it can withstand. I could perhaps put a new o-ring in and wrap it in chemical teflon and try again. Might at least hold the o-ring together instead of allowing it to burn and fall apart.
Jim Lomas has been no help as far as what kind of o-ring they used... they don't answer their emails. But, if anyone needs a bunch of o-rings, I have 24 of one size and 50 of another courtesy of Grainger. (cost 7 dollars for all of them lol).
Yes the o-rings suck for sure. I don't have a ton of miles yet but I'm experimenting with self adhesive silicon tape and regular household silicone, which probably acts more like a lubricant when sliding the head pipe on.
I used about 2-3 wraps stretched fairly tight.
So far it's held up really well.
I was planning on doing a write up after I was confident it worked.
Clean O rings, high temp Permatex and strong springs work for me. Are the springs strong enough or are they too long to provide proper tension??
They were just long enough to hook over and hold the headpipe on semi straight. I noted how little tension there was so I fixed it by flipping the manifolds the other way so the spring hooks were opposite sides of each other and both springs have excellent tension now. I just tried silicone tape as czakky so I'll see how it holds up today when I'm home.
Now I'm pissed off.
Exhaust seems sealed. All good there. Go to head out for lunch and I hesitate pulling out onto a busy road and the bike jerks for just a split second and keeps running when I have the clutch partially pulled. Thinking nothing of it I hit the gas at a clearing and thankfully not like an ass because the bike shoots backwards 2 or 3 feet.
that happened to me when I rode Chucks bike. Very strange feeling.
Double post. Mod can delete.
Quote from: Striker1423 on June 26, 2019, 12:57:12 PM
Now I'm pissed off.
Exhaust seems sealed. All good there. Go to head out for lunch and I hesitate pulling out onto a busy road and the bike jerks for just a split second and keeps running when I have the clutch partially pulled. Thinking nothing of it I hit the gas at a clearing and thankfully not like an ass because the bike shoots backwards 2 or 3 feet.
What ignition are you using? Had the same issue with my bike last year with the VS ignition that I bought a few years back. It hasn't done it this year so far but I hardly have any miles on.
Mine also switched to running backward off of a stop sign. I don't know who was more surprised. Me or the car that was stopped behind me.
Quote from: Organicjedi on June 26, 2019, 04:26:39 PM
Quote from: Striker1423 on June 26, 2019, 12:57:12 PM
Now I'm pissed off.
Exhaust seems sealed. All good there. Go to head out for lunch and I hesitate pulling out onto a busy road and the bike jerks for just a split second and keeps running when I have the clutch partially pulled. Thinking nothing of it I hit the gas at a clearing and thankfully not like an ass because the bike shoots backwards 2 or 3 feet.
What ignition are you using? Had the same issue with my bike last year with the VS ignition that I bought a few years back. It hasn't done it this year so far but I hardly have any miles on.
Mine also switched to running backward off of a stop sign. I don't know who was more surprised. Me or the car that was stopped behind me.
It's a VS ignition. He said check charging system at 7 or 8k. I did and it drops to like 12 to 13 volts. So either it isn't charging, or I have a somewhat bad ground. Nick also suggested I check the magnets with a paper clip, and then double check the timing. I'll do all these things tonight. At this moment I'm just about ready to sell it and be done with bikes for the summer. At least my kayak doesn't break down.
I checked that stuff too and it was fine.
I did recently find a bad connection where my stator plugs in to the main wiring harness. I'm hoping there's the off chance that fixes the running backward issue. From what I understand, the three magnets are what prevent it from running backward. I've heard from a handful of other guys who are having the same issue within the last 2-3 years. All have a VS ignition. Who knows.
My timing was off by a bit. Don't know exactly how but it must have slipped a bit as I triple checked it was at 1.8mm btdc.
But the left cylinder was at 1.6 and the right was at 1.5.
That might have been enough to cause it. So that also probably contributed to my idling issues. Still dont understand what woul have caused it to drift.
When timing is that retarded it's easier for 2 strokes to run backwards.
Chuck
Scott's do it all the time, you can reverse out of a parking bay, a good party trick
That's awesome!
Checked it again today as it started running rough later on in the night. Sure enough, timing was at 1.7 on the left cylinder and I have not checked the right yet. So, I hit the bolt with my small dewalt impact for a few semi-controlled taps. Bolt threaded on another turn or so. Hopefully the rotor won't move again. Left cylinder back at 1.8, and right will be tomorrow! My 4th of July trip up the coast of Lake Huron is coming up rapidly! lol.
Quote from: Striker1423 on July 01, 2019, 10:56:17 PM
Checked it again today as it started running rough later on in the night. Sure enough, timing was at 1.7 on the left cylinder and I have not checked the right yet. So, I hit the bolt with my small dewalt impact for a few semi-controlled taps. Bolt threaded on another turn or so. Hopefully the rotor won't move again. Left cylinder back at 1.8, and right will be tomorrow! My 4th of July trip up the coast of Lake Huron is coming up rapidly! lol.
Happy Fourth of July everyone! :patriot:
She made it! Just a shade over 220 miles. I now know why people don't usually ride little bikes for that distance and unless my hands were just sick of it she started vibrating pretty hardcore by the time I got home. I have a feeling the timing moved again or I'm just unlucky. But, the bike was running fairly well and started hating me around 30 miles from home. Used a half tank of oil and piston slapped her way on her own power.
On another note, I picked up a timing light from Harbor Freight yesterday and out of curiosity I figured I'd try timing the bike using the timing mark position at 1.8mm btdc I verified on the flywheel (*was just before the v notch on the flywheel). I had set the timing to 1.8 using the dial indicator, and wanted to verify where it was firing with the light. I started the bike and put the light on it and the mark was way to the left of the magneto housing, I mean it was way off the notch to the left by about 6 degrees if you looked at it with a protractor. So I moved the left pickup until the mark lined up and it was pinging away in the cylinder. I could hear the spark knock.
So, confused I re-timed it to 1.8 btdc with the dial indicator and ran it today. Seems strange, but why would the mark and the light be that far off? Could this Vito's. crank just be a bit off compared to a Japanese one?
All in all the bike performed and got me home. I'm both happy and nerve-wracked today. :busey:
Going to check the timing again this week, a lot of stuff is changing in my life recently (possible career adjustment coming up) and hopefully for the better. Gonna take the bike on Saturday to a show at a local dealer. Wish me luck, but also please encourage me to not sit on any new motorcycles otherwise bad things might happen lol. :celebrate:
The new motorcycles will soon seem appliance like after the honeymoon. Atleast to an immature Luddite like myself.
I had some weird timing issues on my RD and ended up buying Ed's Dyna kit replaces the points once you set it it will never vary... Now Ed hates me and I think he's the biggest jerk RD guy on the planet but his kit works... I actually had a dream about the jerk last night... Tell him I recommended the kit. Best Dave
Quote from: Striker1423 on July 10, 2019, 07:50:46 PM
Going to check the timing again this week, a lot of stuff is changing in my life recently (possible career adjustment coming up) and hopefully for the better. Gonna take the bike on Saturday to a show at a local dealer. Wish me luck, but also please encourage me to not sit on any new motorcycles otherwise bad things might happen lol. :celebrate:
New bikes are fun. I picked up a new Aprilia Tuono Factory a couple of months ago and it's an amazing machine. A guy can't eat chicken his whole life, right? Sometimes you need a steak. (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190731/9071a9aaf61187dc8d2596b421433749.jpg)
Alright I've pulled the carbs back off and am setting the float height down 1mm. (Basically making it a 90 degree angle to the carb body), hopefully that helps prevent over flow when it's on a hill. I'm also debating on what to do with the pilot jet. 35 just seems huge for this setup. Most people run 27 5 or 30 in the 350 with this mod, so I suppose I can try again, but would like an opinion on the pilot jet.
Carbs are being cleaned again just cause that's how I roll lol. Want to get this right. 200 mains are perfect.
Run the 35 pilots, even if they are a little too big it wont really matter.
Reset the carburetor float height, and carb sync. Runs much better than it ever has. Looks like it was carbs after all. No fluctuations in idle either!