Might EFI my 1976 RD400 this winter

[sav0r]

EGT is great because the human brain can comprehend it. It's a valuable tool for a human tuning in real time.

Lambda is more appropriate for an ECU. There isn't a particularly good way of using O2 as a human for tuning in real time. It's better left to computers. Even when looking at data for Lambda it generally gets massively smoothed, which is dumb, because A computer can react to it in real time. That's what makes it better. It's just more sensitive.

[747drvr]

i was referring to the hobbyist planes more than anything, piston props. But still. trends on the data will show up vs the o2, and if a head temp is used as well. whos looking at the gauge in this MC application to write a map? (efi) this would all have to be data logged.

The ITT is egt just taken between low speed and high speed turbines.

very true..but in the cockpit n1 and epr are the main indications for settings ...the rest of the engine parameters are for info only   usually during engine start when airflow is minimal

[rd400canuck]

thanks for all the input guys.

I really only want the EGT for steady throttle readings... like cruising at 60 kmh 70, 80 90 100 110 ect and wide open. I'll take note of these with my cell phone video recording then write them down at home where I can compare the Speedo and EGT reading. At most I'll have 10 readings from my current carb setup which I feel is pretty good if on the rich side. I'll have these numbers to look at later when I am tuning the fuel table. It'll be nice to know when I am dialing in EFI I am not going too far over these temps... just really to put my mind at ease that I am heading in the right direction.

The O2 logging will also be happening at the same time. I'll have the laptop in my backpack and later I can compare what a/f ratios correspond to which speeds and EGT temps.

Once I know these relationships I think I'll have enough data to ensure I'm not going to melt the piston crowns when dialing in the efi table. That's the plan anyway!

Actually I'm hoping Megasquirt has kept up with the times and I can do all the logging on my phone with Bluetooth.

[747drvr]

reading all that stuff about efi made my head hurt !!!  so i went out and ran the piss out of my poor rd !!!  better than taking excedrin 

[m in sc]

i used my wideband to tune the holley  in my galaxie. no efi and it worked great.  get textbook readings when driving it now that it's dialed in, so not so sure the 02 needs to be only left to computers.    just saying. any info that can be gained for trends of motor running have value.. and I know fuck all about airplanes 

[sav0r]

You used something with a display that smoothed the signal? I think it was Klotz that sold a wideband sensor with an LED setup, it was probably sold by many manufacturers, but you could weld a bung in an exhaust, pop the sensor in, and if the lights were green you were in a good range. Cool. That's not the same as closed loop EFI though. It's not even close to recording at like 200hz and then building maps from the data. That's what I'm getting at.

[m in sc]

autometer afr gauge in the galaxie. but i have used a dynojet one used on a bike as well to write an efi map that also data logged into a power commander. both have real time readouts (numbers)   

[teazer]

I used a relatively cheap Innovate single channel MTX-L which uses a Bosch Wideband O2 sensor, and logged that onto their PL1 logger.  They have expanded their range of gauges  and now sell a neat two channel system. https://g8only.com/product/innovate-motorsports-dlg-1-dual-lambda-airfuel-ratio-gauge/

I had to modify the oil pump arm to add a TPS to it so I could also log throttle position and RPM.  And agree with Mark and Savor that with data logged, it might be able to be interpreted, but real time not so much.

[rd400canuck]

I have a couple questions that I dont have the knowledge to answer...

Lets say I am holding the bike at a steady 5000rpm at 50% (or 70, 80, 90, 100%) throttle under a load.

Can I just add/delete injector pulse width until the bike no longer gains rpms and assume that is the the optimum setting for that rpm/throttle setting for max power?

Also, If i ever want to create my own ignition map.. can I do the same with retard/advance of ignition for a set rpm/throttle, back it off a degree for safety and call it a day?

[m in sc]

# of pulses better vs duration to control, and yes timing can and should be adjustable.  lots of options there

[rd400canuck]

Found a Wideband setup... seems pretty decent for the price.

https://www.amazon.ca/Innovate-Motorsports-3877-Wideband-Controller/dp/B00FFTAJPC/ref=sr_1_29?dchild=1&keywords=wideband&qid=1634228998&sr=8-29

[teazer]

That gets you a Bosch sensor, and LC-2 plus connector to a serial port to data log. If you want to see the data in real time, you have to add a meter.

[rd400canuck]

That gets you a Bosch sensor, and LC-2 plus connector to a serial port to data log. If you want to see the data in real time, you have to add a meter.

I planning on hooking it up to Microsquirt then bluetooth to my phone. There is a megasquirt app for phones.... not sure how well it works tho. Looking into it

[rd400canuck]

OK... everything has been ordered.... god help me (and you guys too, of course) down the rabbit hole I go again 

Ordered the VAPE from EC, the Microsquirt and R6 throttle bodies.

Still trying to find an external inline efi fuel pump that isnt capable of 250HP...  Id like to draw as little as possible... however the vape has 150w.

Any ideas on fuel pump?

[teazer]

I have a couple questions that I dont have the knowledge to answer...

Lets say I am holding the bike at a steady 5000rpm at 50% (or 70, 80, 90, 100%) throttle under a load.

Can I just add/delete injector pulse width until the bike no longer gains rpms and assume that is the the optimum setting for that rpm/throttle setting for max power?

Also, If i ever want to create my own ignition map.. can I do the same with retard/advance of ignition for a set rpm/throttle, back it off a degree for safety and call it a day?

Yes and no.

At say 100% throttle at say 5,000 rpm, the bike should accelerate.  If you had an eddy current dyno that adjusts the load to keep rpm steady, you could do what you suggested.  You basically set it to run from say 2,500 to peak revs at say 10% throttle and log the A:F and repeat every 10% to see what the "map" is and then adjust it from there to get the A:F you want at any point on the map.  At cruise, you want a fairly lean (not catastrophically lean) condition and as you open the throttle you want to get to power A"F which is much richer. At higher revs and say 0-20% throttle you need to be a little richer to avoid a lean stumble as you slow down.